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California Special verses the Shelby

390cs68rcode

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Scott

thanks for checking. Can't really think of anything at the moment.

I could keep that yellow car company if you get tired of it.
 

GTCSMustang

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Rhonda,

I took a look at how many parts on a 1968 Shelby Mustang are Shelby-specific and I came up with 122. These are parts with a Shelby part number and not a Ford part number (S7MS or S8MS). They would have been ordered from "The Shelby Parts Company" in Torrance California and not from Ford. Someone can probably come up with the parts that are GT/CS specific and which ones are carried over from Shelby.

Scott
 
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PNewitt

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I have documention of '68 Shelby parts, and GT/CS parts listed side-by-side, with the CS parts assigned Ford part numbers.

These (fiberglas) parts were made at A.O. Smith in Michigan, and sent by rail to the San Jose plant for the GT/CS.

The Torrance location was most likely a service parts location for the West Coast for Shelby/Ford.

Paul N.
 

GTCSMustang

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Right, the Torrance facility was a service parts center. So, how close did I come on the parts count?

Scott
 
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Mustanglvr

Mustanglvr

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So how many Ford/Mustang parts are on a Shelby (post 1967) verses a California Special? If Shelby distanced himself from the Shelbys after the factory moved, then doesn`t the Shelby have just about as much Shelby influence as the California Special? If the Shelbys were`nt considered the proverbial racecars after 1967 then how are they so much different then the GT/CS? It looks like Ford wanted to produce a car people would mistake for a Shelby. Why else would they not put the name Ford on them anywhere?
 

rvrtrash

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Don't get me wrong, I love my CS, but when I was putting it back together, it was so hard not to put a '68 Shelby nose on it. I just like the looks of them. The only reason I didn't, is because I wanted to stay true to the car and not have people think the whole thing was an Eleanor wantabe. I'm thinking that when I finish a couple of car projects I'm working on though, a few cars will go up for sale to make room and I'll have to do a Lil' Red clone. I agree with JB. To bad we didn't get the nose to start with.
Steve
 

Mosesatm

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Rhonda, I agree with you in that a J-code or R-code GT/CS GT with a deluxe interior is basically a Shelby coupe without the front fiberglass. If more had been equipped with the GT package and one of those engines people would probably take our cars more seriously. I think it's a little tough for people to consider our cars Shelby-related when most of them were equipped with 289 2Vs and some came with 6 cylinders, just like regular Mustangs. It might help our cause if, when we explain our cars to people, we stress the Shelby connection a little more. I wonder if it would help to get an article published in a Mustang, Shelby, or car collecting magazine that explains that relationship so we could use it to support our claim. We could all laminate it and carry it with us!
 

68gt390

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It seems that throughout this whole thread all everybody is talking about is the Shelby connection. Myself, I could care less about the Shelby connection. I don't know about everybody else but, at every show I go to I have to explain that the car is not a Shelby. Everyone back in this area thinks it's a Shelby simply because of the tail section on the car. There are a few who actually know what the car is. I like it simply because it's a Mustang and it is different from your run of the mill Stang. Our cars are unique in themselves and I think that is what we should accept. As far as I'm concerned I like the fact that we're not cramed into large group of Shelby wantabees. It is a car produced by Ford with it's own unique package and to me that is what makes it stand alone from anyother Stang. I'll appologize now if I've offended anyone but, that's the way I look at my GT/CS.

Don
 

390cs68rcode

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I agree with Don. I like Mustangs and to me this is a unique Mustang that you just donb't see many of, that's why I like them the way I do. Yes, the car shares some parts with Shelby's and that adds a cool factor for me.
 

Mosesatm

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I agree with both of you but the original question was regarding the connection between Shelby and the GT/CS.



California Special verses the Shelby

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I would really like to get some imput on the subject of the Shelby influence regarding the California Special. I know we`ve discussed this at length but I feel something needs to be clarified. I read the other day on a site that the California Special is in no way a Shelby. So how much of a Shelby is Mustang and/or Ford? Are Shelbys Mustangs or Cobras? Why does`nt the California Special have the Ford logo anywhere on it, except on the individual parts where it says FOMOCO? Don`t the Shelby`s have the same parts?I don`t want my car to be a Shelby, but I would like it to be worth as much as one. I guess, since people don`t know much about them ,is why they are not recognized as being as rare and expensive? That does`nt make any sense. Maybe the California Special was Ford`s rendition of the Shelby and should be recognized as such. I would like to know how much Shelby influence there is in an actual Shelby compared to the California Special. Any comments?
 

68gt390

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Arlie;
The GT/CS does have the "Ford" logo on it. Open your door and check out your sill plate. Right there in clear blue letter's it says "Product of Ford". Not to belabor the point, we would all like our cars to be worth as much as a Shelby. At this point and time that ain't happening. We don't have the mistique of the "Shelby" name on our cars and probably never will. It just seems everyone wants that "Shelby" connection thinking that will raise the prices of our cars. I just don't understand why folks can't accept the GT/CS for what it is. Look at the parts list here on this site. Several of our pieces on the car have the "Shelby" part #. Yes, our rear tail section came from the 68 "Shelby" convertible, our tail lights come from the 65 Thunderbird and our fog lights to come from the "Shelby". Those items alone I would think would answer the question everybody keeps asking. :frust: I just don't see this as one of those type deals were one size fits all. It's a question we may never have an answer to.

Don
 

Mosesatm

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You're right Don. It becomes an even more ambiguous subject when many Shelby purists don't even consider '68 Shelbys to be Shelbys.

If a '68 Shelby is just a Mustang, as the purists claim, then a GT/CS is certainly just a Mustang. On the other hand, if one considers the '68 Shelby to be a Shelby then there is some connection between the Shelby and the GT/CS. How to quantify that connection seems almost impossible unless one does the type of analysis Scott did by looking at the number of parts on each. Doing such an analysis would drive me crazy and the subject isn't important enough to me to spend that kind of time on it but it's good that someone is interested enough in this topic to do that type of research. To me this thread is an interesting topic for those who like to discuss topics with no real answer, sort of like the Da Vinci Code.

My opinion is that the Shelby was such a corporate car by the time '68 rolled around that, conceptually speaking, if one calls a '68 Shelby a Shelby then a J-code, or R-code GT/CS with a deluxe interior, and the GT option is just as much of a Shelby. It just doesn't have the Shelby name all over it, but again, in '68 I think that the car was so watered down that the Shelby name was just a name. Quite a name though, since it triples or quadruples the value of the nearly identical cars.
 
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Mustanglvr

Mustanglvr

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Even the Shelby clones are going for astronomical prices. Maybe we should get some Shelby script and put that on our GT/CS`s and then they will be recognized and be worth more. I guess I feel that the GT/CS is a bastard child of the Shelby. I read an ad that was recently on Ebay where the seller was talking about selling a Shelby clone and that it had everything a Shelby had, just not the pedigree. Well the GT/CS does`nt have everything a Shelby has, but it is more of a Shelby than a Shelby clone I`d think. At least it is authentic. A standard needs to be set for the GT/CS and the HCS. I think the GT/CS has the pedigree, it is just not recognized.
 

Mosesatm

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Rhonda, I think one big reason the pedigree of our cars isn't quite so obvious is that most owners install styled steel wheels (me included). I'll bet just upgrading to 10-spokes would make that connection much stronger and selling prices would increase.
 

68gt390

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Arlie;
I guess in all this discussion, that's the one thing I like about our cars the most. We can still do what we want with them. You want styled steel wheels, put them on. You want the duel GT valance, put it on. We don't have to be such purists that we wind up having a car that we're afraid to do things to. Even with that said, all the things that we can do to our cars are still period correct and to me look great on them. I've had comments and have received emails from friends of mine about my swapping out my 390 for a 428CJ. The bottom line is even though my car is a "S" code, the 428CJ is still period correct and to be honest about the whole thing, to me I think it will increase it's value in the long run. And even if it doesn't, it's the way I want the car. :grin:

Don
 

Mosesatm

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I agree. California Specials are a perfect compromise between average run of the mill Mustangs and super expensive Shelbys.
 

68Fan

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When I was 15 and about to get out on that open road, of course I dreamed of owning a Shelby and having everyone say..."wow, what a nice car", "Cool ride", etc. I think we can all say we have day dreamed about it. I mean it would be great to have a "king of the road" sitting in our garage. However, post puberty, when I started looking for a car to enjoy and be proud of my eye quickly fell to the GT/CS. Not because it looked like a Shelby but because it is a unique 60's muscle car with character and style (much like many of the folks on this site). I absolutely agree we, GT/CS owners have a lot more flexibility when it comes to turning screws and I'd bet we have more fun with our cars than say, someone driving around w/ a car in the high 6 digits. Enjoy the wonderful world surrounding our classics and get out to your local shows. Be proud and tell folks about you good fortune.
 
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PNewitt

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There's a long answer to all of this, and I think there is an "identity crisis" that we don't need to get into here.

The GT/CS was ONLY a MARKETING plan to sell Mustangs. Not an ENGINE plan, nor was it a SHELBY plan. It was a quick corporate decision at Ford to sell Mustangs by getting people's attention. It represented the thinking at that time, and in doing this car, they really didn't care about how it would fit into the scheme of things with the Shelby lineage, nor did they care.

I think there is a false concern that we need to somehow know where this "missing link" belongs between Mustang and Shelby. That's something I will clarify in the book.

However..I suggest that we focus on the simple fact that this car IS what it IS. We don't need to feel any kind of akwardness about our cars if some (unaware) person challenges you on whether is is a Shelby or not. That, frankly, is their problem, not yours to explain or justify.

Let's start right now thinking about how we have this unique Mustang, and set a standard of it being what it is. It's a limited edition Mustang made in California, with Shelby parts. Let's be proud of that heritage. Let's make that mark in the Mustang world, and be proud of it. Know what it is--and isn't. If you don't want to think that it's a Shelby Automotive product, then think of it as the best Mustang coupe ever made!

There is no need for an identity crisis here. Be greatful for having a very rare Mustang that gets more attention at car shows--and in public than most others.

Paul N.
 

rvrtrash

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68gt390 said:
It seems that throughout this whole thread all everybody is talking about is the Shelby connection.

Don

Hey Don, I think you're right for some. Our cars are probably as close to a $100K car that we will ever get and there is a wish to capitalize on that. I for one though wish the CS had the "Shelby" front end not because I want people to think it's a Shelby or I wish it was, but because I just like the looks of it. The car I'm restoring right now is a '69 Fairlane 500 convertible and I'm going to fabricate a Talledaga nose for it. How many even have heard of a Talledaga and there was never a convertible, but I don't care. I like the look, although I'm going to have the hood scoop instead of the smooth hood because I like that look also. Anyway, I think a lot of us here are old hot rodders and just like the go-fast look, no matter who's name is on it.:grin:
Steve
 
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