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Old 09/22/2012, 12:39 PM   #1
Mosesatm
 
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Early Cars

On page 30 of the first GT/CS Recognition Guide Paul states that some Southern Oregon Gold Nugget Special cars were built alongside California Specials, which to me implies that they share all the special parts (Note the 2nd line from the top).

If we keep Paul's statement in mind then add the fact that we have 3 early cars with 74 (Seattle) DSOs with GT/CS parts on them I think those 3 early cars are hybrid Gold Nugget Special / California Special cars.

If they are hybrids I wonder how many others were built, and what do we call them?
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Old 09/22/2012, 02:23 PM   #2
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Arlie,
Also notice the script on the rear quarter of the stage car. I encourage all owners to look at the relationship to the reflector and/or the top of the rear fender. It is a small picture but it is obvious that it is higher than a normal later GT/CS car. My GNS has the holes in this location. I moved the script down in 1989 when I painted it white. I thought it looked add and templated a local car that was an later one and now they are in the more normal location. We need to find out who owns these early cars and get a close look at them. This may clear up a lot about the first 20 or so cars that were converted into GT/CS cars that were pulled from the line early. My car was heavily optioned also. It is a J code, deluxe interior, tinted windows, convenience group, rear window defroster, lower console, automatic car. Their was a rumor that all stage cars had tachs, but in Paul’s last book there is an all white stage car without a tach clearly shown in one of the pictures.

Does anyone have a clue where some of these early cars are?

Rob
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Old 09/22/2012, 03:58 PM   #3
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Mustang Biz has the aqua with the white roof.

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Old 09/22/2012, 04:25 PM   #4
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This may be controversial. Just because the car that Paul found was loaded and the right color does not mean it was on the stage. The script on the stage car is noticeably higher than the one that Paul said was “on the stage” in his new book. It may have had the scripts lowered over the years, but it looked pretty rough and original when I last saw pictures of it. Nothing ever was identified that it was on the stage to my knowledge other than it was a close sister to the one shown in the stage pictures. I still feel that the higher script is a determining factor.

I tried to find the old site for Mustang Biz, but it is not available anymore and it seems he may have sold the car. The car may have been that very one, but I am still not convinced.

Rob
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Old 09/22/2012, 08:46 PM   #5
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Curtis still had the car a few months ago. I think he has sold most of the others. I am sure he would be open to any investagation you may want to do. It was a very early VIN. If you want his contact information PM me.
Marty

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Old 09/23/2012, 12:03 AM   #6
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I have had some thoughts on this subject for a while now.

We recently visited the owner of the very first Cougar, 7F91S500001. (Look for an upcoming video on our WCCC TV) That car was specially constructed, because Mercury intended for it to go on the show circuit. That Cougar had all of the door jamb and trunk seams smoothed and blended. Flawless factory paint remained on the car when it was found.
The reason was that it was intended to be shown and filmed with doors and trunk lid open. It also does not have air conditioning, because Ford felt that it detracted from the engine compartment.

My guess is that Ford in San Jose, specially created one (or several) cars with hand fitted fiberglass panels for in-house final design and approval. These cars would have been mostly hand built (converted) by the engineering or design team. It is very likely that this/these cars were never designated as GT/CS models, but mearly 'project' cars for internal full scale mock ups. They also were very likely used at the presentation on Feb 15. I believe that it is possible that several of the cars shown Feb 15, will not have Marti verified designations of GT/CS. The test mule cars, probably were not accounted for in the first 200 cars.

In the final recognition guide, the author mentions the stage car as being a GT model and that it has been identified. The other 6 cars, very possibly, were a mix of standard and deluxe interiors, hub caps/style steel wheels, we can see in the pictures, different stripe colors and with and without vinyl tops. I would expect different engine examples too.

Scott Behncke
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Old 09/23/2012, 11:02 AM   #7
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Scott,
You are hitting the nail on the head. The last book has all sorts of facts that indicate that the early cars were fully assembled and converted. Maybe as many as 200 as page 75 and page 190 indicate.

Also I retract my early statement in this thread. Page 60 shows the stage car that Curtis owns and the script is noticeably higher like the original picture on the stage. Curtis I appologize and you have one rare GT/CS and a piece of history!

I think, once again, that the early cars are recognized by the placement of the script on the rear quarter. Study page 46, 49, and page 60 to get a relationship between the “California” script and the "Mustang" script on the trunk spoiler. They are nearly equal in height on the car. Then turn to page 72 and copare the two scipts. It clearly displays that the later cars had the script much lower. My guess is this was driven by the fact that of the transition from recessed reflectors to the later bolt on style.

Marty,
If you know Curtis, a corner close up with a Mustang script on the trunk from a a kneeling position to capture both the California and Mustang script would be awesome. Also one with a ruler or cloth measuring tape on the quarter showing the distance down from the top edge of the quarter panel would be huge.

To think as many as 200 cars “may” have been built and awaiting script is huge. None of them would be Marti verified in my opinion or maybe a large percentage of them.

Rob
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Old 09/23/2012, 01:01 PM   #8
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Rob,
Remember this blue car in Sumner?
It has the high script position.

It also has the real early tail light panel.

The last photo shows the alignment between the Calfornia and the Mustang on a normal GT/CS.

It looks like the California pretty well lines up with the top of the tail light panel.
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Old 09/23/2012, 01:12 PM   #9
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Here is the white debut car from Paul's 2011 book.
Its script seems to be at least 1" higher than normal.

Compare it to the placement on this early car.
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Old 09/23/2012, 01:58 PM   #10
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Arlie,
The guy trying to sell the car in Sumner near me had a bunch of health issues and I never could hook up. Do you remeber his name or contact information? That script is very high like mine was and the stage cars.

Rob
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Old 09/23/2012, 07:41 PM   #11
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Hey all, Curtis here, Marty gave me a heads up about this thread. The mustang.biz site is currently down. I have only 2 cars remaining, a 4 speed and the J code being discussed.

I'm currently on vacation in Brazil, so it'll be a while before I can post any photos.

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Old 09/24/2012, 09:06 AM   #12
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Robert, this would explain why so much of your car appears original without being listed as a CS on the Marti Report. I'm curious what your Marti lists as the order type. If it was an "engineering prototype", it seems there would be some sort of mention of it. Scott, do you know what that first Cougar that was destined for the show circuit listed as order type? I wonder if there might be clues we could piece together to more firmly identify the early cars.

Steve

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Old 09/24/2012, 05:29 PM   #13
robert campbell
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Steve,
I think the higher script placement is the definitive clue. I still have the "higher" holes in my right quarter panel only. The left one has been replaced by me to correct an earlier poor replacement. It is the one clue that in my mind certifies Curtis's car on the stage.

Rob
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Old 10/03/2012, 07:58 AM   #14
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If you're referring to the 8 access holes (4 per side) they just get the round rubber plugs. No sealant. Purchase the kit of body plugs. The extra pieces come in handy.
Ron from R&R on this site can help you.

Neil
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Old 10/03/2012, 05:44 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rvrtrash View Post
Robert, this would explain why so much of your car appears original without being listed as a CS on the Marti Report. I'm curious what your Marti lists as the order type. If it was an "engineering prototype", it seems there would be some sort of mention of it. Scott, do you know what that first Cougar that was destined for the show circuit listed as order type? I wonder if there might be clues we could piece together to more firmly identify the early cars.

Steve
Steve,
Order type on my elite Marti report says "local promotion".

Rob
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